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I want to get alot of things cleared up.

Frussly

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#1
So here's a collection of a couple different things i want to get some attention on:


Jailbreak
  • Do not delay the round or stall the round.
1.1 If you were to ask me it is sort of implied without warden having to say it. Warden says GO TO the blue line and AFK freeze, reds can pick whatever blue line, and that’s fine and all. But if the warden says “No detours or delays”, it’s a detour if you pick anything but the closest to you?
I don’t know if I’m the only person that think that’s logical, but I’ve killed a lot people for it already, and now I’ve been getting some information that at least 3 other staff members don’t think so?

1.2 But then again, if you don’t do the order you’re KOS anyway, which is my second point: If you don’t do the order you’re KOS. Simple. But if you can delay and detour, without the warden saying the command “no detours or delays”, people will abuse that regardless if it’s a thing. The only ruling (as listed at the top) about delaying is listed under General Jailbreak Rules. So why should wardens say it, if you’re delaying the round intentionally by not doing the wardens order?


Wardens not being able to slay whilst staff is on

So i was told by Eight that if staff is on, Wardens shouldn't be using their /wslay, as it is considered backseat moderating.
If it is considering backseat moderating why even give the option to slay a blue?

I was given the "reasoning" if you can call it that: "Why do we give VIP's vote commands?". It's a way of saying thank you, a special perk for those who help out the community. Not to backseat moderate. Just like in Jailbreak where wardens have the option to slay people, if they don't comply because they are on the same team.

I seriously don't see the problem with allowing them to use it, even whilst staff is on, since its at their disposal and the worst that can happen is someone getting slayed falsely, and they can be respawned. Instead of the staff member asking for the reasoning behind the thought of slaying, every time that the warden wants to slay someone, the warden could just briefly explain why, or if the staff member has seen it, he/she could just slay instead of waiting for the vote.

If the staff member is on red, having to follow orders whilst administrating/moderating is a nightmare. You simply cannot do it properly. The wardens should, yet again, be able to use it for these situations, so they don't get restricted to being a shrimp whilst playing because a staff is there.


Unspoken rules, that isn't written down anywhere

1. Wardens not being able to slay whilst staff is on.
>It's dumb. Just list it.


A re-do of the Rebel status rules?
  • Rebels can be pardoned when their rebel status goes away,
  • Only staff can define what favouritism is.
Also slight error with a , instead of a .

1.1 With the current system that is implemented on the servers, a red that attacks any guard for any reason, is a rebeller. Guard baiting? Hit them to go away? REBELLER. Lets say that all reds failed to do an order and the warden wanted to pardon them. According to the rules he can only pardon all of them, otherwise it would be favoritism, but he cant pardon the one guy because he has the rebeller status, which is dumb and contradicting.

1.2 If staff are the only ones to define it, why not just make a simple way of understanding it, instead of having 25 (somewhat) different definitions of it? I get that staff should be smarter than most of the players, but it's still a massive point of confusion when i tell people that make their custom last requests involve a red,

I don't wanna hear the reasoning "its common knowledge". No its not. We're talking about the internet. There is no common knowledge and everyone needs a simple & clear way of understanding things cut in pieces and served on a plate.
 

kokostal

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#2
Gonna give my own opinion on these

1.1 If you were to ask me it is sort of implied without warden having to say it. Warden says GO TO the blue line and AFK freeze, reds can pick whatever blue line, and that’s fine and all. But if the warden says “No detours or delays”, it’s a detour if you pick anything but the closest to you?
I don’t know if I’m the only person that think that’s logical, but I’ve killed a lot people for it already, and now I’ve been getting some information that at least 3 other staff members don’t think so?
If warden says "no detours or delays" but doesnt specify which line, reds should be allowed to go whatever blue line they want go as long as theyre not detouring or delaying when going to that line. The line is just one of the things warden should specify.

1.2 But then again, if you don’t do the order you’re KOS anyway, which is my second point: If you don’t do the order you’re KOS. Simple. But if you can delay and detour, without the warden saying the command “no detours or delays”, people will abuse that regardless if it’s a thing. The only ruling (as listed at the top) about delaying is listed under General Jailbreak Rules. So why should wardens say it, if you’re delaying the round intentionally by not doing the wardens order?
The rules say this: "do not delay the round or stall the round" so yeah, i suppose warden would only have to maybe say "no detours" or warden doesnt have to say anything about detours or delays at all. I suggest that this rule is changed so that it only applies to last guards or last reds that are intentionally delaying by hiding in a corner without rebelling or killing reds.


So i was told by Eight that if staff is on, Wardens shouldn't be using their /wslay, as it is considered backseat moderating.
If it is considering backseat moderating why even give the option to slay a blue?
I agree on this, warden should be able to wslay people when staff is on, i dont see a problem with it. Staff should be able to catch it anyway (even on red usually) unless theyre not doing their job or not paying attention in which case warden needs to take it upon himself to slay the blue.

1.1 With the current system that is implemented on the servers, a red that attacks any guard for any reason, is a rebeller. Guard baiting? Hit them to go away? REBELLER. Lets say that all reds failed to do an order and the warden wanted to pardon them. According to the rules he can only pardon all of them, otherwise it would be favoritism, but he cant pardon the one guy because he has the rebeller status, which is dumb and contradicting.
"Rebels can be pardoned when their rebel status goes away", not "reds can be pardoned when their rebel status goes away" ( this is how i take it pls dont kill me). A red who hit a blu because they were baiting isnt a rebel, so they should be able to get pardoned though i might be reading it wrong here.

1.2 If staff are the only ones to define it, why not just make a simple way of understanding it, instead of having 25 (somewhat) different definitions of it? I get that staff should be smarter than most of the players, but it's still a massive point of confusion when i tell people that make their custom last requests involve a red,
Maybe a few rulings should be made about this, though to be honest staff should be able to see what favoritism is and what isnt. Any lr that involved picking a certain red to do someting special or whatever such as "next round warden has to make "insert red name" jump constantly" or "pick "insert red" for this" etc is favoritism. If members would have to determine what favoritism was then id agree that rulings should be made but we are staff. We are supposed to be smarter then members, be confident and make these decisions.

Some of this might be rarted but its just what i think, pls dont kill me xoxo
 
Last edited:

Eight

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#3
As with my Jailbreak rulings discussion thread, I don't see any reason to keep this only between staff. Non-staff are free to leave complaints about the other rulings if need be/contribute to the discussion.

Moving to Help Desk.
 

R4

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#4
1.2 But then again, if you don’t do the order you’re KOS anyway, which is my second point: If you don’t do the order you’re KOS. Simple. But if you can delay and detour, without the warden saying the command “no detours or delays”, people will abuse that regardless if it’s a thing. The only ruling (as listed at the top) about delaying is listed under General Jailbreak Rules. So why should wardens say it, if you’re delaying the round intentionally by not doing the wardens order?

I don't really follow what you are saying here, but if no detours and delays is not specified reds may to a reasonable degree detour.

Stating no D&D means they must head straight on, no matter what.


Wardens not being able to slay whilst staff is on

So i was told by Eight that if staff is on, Wardens shouldn't be using their /wslay, as it is considered backseat moderating.

If it is considering backseat moderating why even give the option to slay a blue?


I was given the "reasoning" if you can call it that: "Why do we give VIP's vote commands?". It's a way of saying thank you, a special perk for those who help out the community. Not to backseat moderate. Just like in Jailbreak where wardens have the option to slay people, if they don't comply because they are on the same team.


I seriously don't see the problem with allowing them to use it, even whilst staff is on, since its at their disposal and the worst that can happen is someone getting slayed falsely, and they can be respawned. Instead of the staff member asking for the reasoning behind the thought of slaying, every time that the warden wants to slay someone, the warden could just briefly explain why, or if the staff member has seen it, he/she could just slay instead of waiting for the vote.


If the staff member is on red, having to follow orders whilst administrating/moderating is a nightmare. You simply cannot do it properly. The wardens should, yet again, be able to use it for these situations, so they don't get restricted to being a shrimp whilst playing because a staff is there.

They are given the option to slay blue, so that when staff is not available they may use it responsibly to solve issues.

When staff are online, they should not be using it as it interferes with staff doing their job and may lead to mistakes.

Warden slay is a last resort, it's not something that should be used regularly or encouraged unless necessary.

Instead of running the risk of people being false slayed and staff having to solve that you should just remove it alltogether by not allowing them to use it when staff are online. Instead let them do their job as they should have far better judgement than a warden.


I've played hundreds of hours of JB, most of it on RED. This has rarely ever intefered with my ability to moderate effectively.

It does not take long to type a command to slay a rouge blue.





Unspoken rules, that isn't written down anywhere

1. Wardens not being able to slay whilst staff is on.

>It's dumb. Just list it.
Every rule you add makes it more likely that people won't read.

It's a balancing act of not making the rules not too long and making sure rulings are common knowledge.


A re-do of the Rebel status rules?

Rebels can be pardoned when their rebel status goes away,
Only staff can define what favouritism is.

Also slight error with a , instead of a .


1.1 With the current system that is implemented on the servers, a red that attacks any guard for any reason, is a rebeller. Guard baiting? Hit them to go away? REBELLER. Lets say that all reds failed to do an order and the warden wanted to pardon them. According to the rules he can only pardon all of them, otherwise it would be favoritism, but he cant pardon the one guy because he has the rebeller status, which is dumb and contradicting.


1.2 If staff are the only ones to define it, why not just make a simple way of understanding it, instead of having 25 (somewhat) different definitions of it? I get that staff should be smarter than most of the players, but it's still a massive point of confusion when i tell people that make their custom last requests involve a red,


I don't wanna hear the reasoning "its common knowledge". No its not. We're talking about the internet. There is no common knowledge and everyone needs a simple & clear way of understanding things cut in pieces and served on a plate.

You've said it's dumb and contradicting but you've literally supplied no reasons as to why that's true.

It's pretty clear why that rule is in place, pardoning single reds would lead to favouritism with wardens being allowed to pardon their friends for inane reasons. Banning pardoning altogether or until their rebel status is gone would be equally bad, as this would mean wardens could not correct mistakes.

By forcing them to pardon everyone, it means wardens will only use it when it's an actual issue with an order while still allowing them discretion.


You literally cannot cover every edgecase of what favouritism is or any rule for that matter.

Such a list could cover pages of text and still contain loopholes, hence the only way to deal with it is an open ended rule which allows staff discretion to mantain balance and fair play. That's just the nature of it, there's no other way.
 
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Eight

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#5
Jailbreak
- Do not delay the round or stall the round.
1.1 If you were to ask me it is sort of implied without warden having to say it. Warden says GO TO the blue line and AFK freeze, reds can pick whatever blue line, and that’s fine and all. But if the warden says “No detours or delays”, it’s a detour if you pick anything but the closest to you?
I don’t know if I’m the only person that think that’s logical, but I’ve killed a lot people for it already, and now I’ve been getting some information that at least 3 other staff members don’t think so?

1.2 But then again, if you don’t do the order you’re KOS anyway, which is my second point: If you don’t do the order you’re KOS. Simple. But if you can delay and detour, without the warden saying the command “no detours or delays”, people will abuse that regardless if it’s a thing. The only ruling (as listed at the top) about delaying is listed under General Jailbreak Rules. So why should wardens say it, if you’re delaying the round intentionally by not doing the wardens order?
1.1 - No detours or delays following the order. If he orders you to go to the blue line, and doesn't specify, it isn't detouring or delaying to take a direct route to another blue line that isn't the one closest to cells. Him not specifying which blue line means it's open for interpretation the blue line he is talking about, therefore so long as you are not taking a detour or delaying going to the blue line you chose, you are following the order.

1.2 - As I see it, detouring or delaying an order is technically following it, you are just taking really slow to follow it. For example, if you were told to go to the blue line in knifepit, and you went around the main cell area then to knifepit, you were going and then went to the blue line in knifepit, thereby following the order, you just took a detour/delay doing it. Also detouring or delaying orders isn't violating this rule, you aren't stalling or delaying the round as a whole if you are detouring or delaying a warden's order, it really doesn't elongate the round more than any other type of rebeller would.

Wardens not being able to slay whilst staff is on
So i was told by Eight that if staff is on, Wardens shouldn't be using their /wslay, as it is considered backseat moderating.
If it is considering backseat moderating why even give the option to slay a blue?

I was given the "reasoning" if you can call it that: "Why do we give VIP's vote commands?". It's a way of saying thank you, a special perk for those who help out the community. Not to backseat moderate. Just like in Jailbreak where wardens have the option to slay people, if they don't comply because they are on the same team.

I seriously don't see the problem with allowing them to use it, even whilst staff is on, since its at their disposal and the worst that can happen is someone getting slayed falsely, and they can be respawned. Instead of the staff member asking for the reasoning behind the thought of slaying, every time that the warden wants to slay someone, the warden could just briefly explain why, or if the staff member has seen it, he/she could just slay instead of waiting for the vote.

If the staff member is on red, having to follow orders whilst administrating/moderating is a nightmare. You simply cannot do it properly. The wardens should, yet again, be able to use it for these situations, so they don't get restricted to being a shrimp whilst playing because a staff is there.
- Well yes VIP perks are given as a thanks for donating, and it is not meant to be used to backseat moderate. This is why we don't allow it when staff are in-game and why we tell VIPs to call for staff first, so they don't act like they have the authority of a staff to punish users at their own discretion instead of ask for staff to. The perk is only there to help in the absence of staff. This is the same with Warden vote slay, there are plentiful issues in game and staff can not be on every Jailbreak server 24/7, so it's in the absence of staff wardens can use this.

- The warden hasn't applied for staff and put into a role of moderation, we can not simply take their word to slay whoever they see is rule-breaking when there is someone on the server who is in staff and in the proper role to do that. I say that the topic of VIPs not being able to backseat moderate parallels this because VIPs are no more trusted than Warden in regards to moderation, so why are they in more of a right to pick up for staff where they are "cannot do it properly" relative to VIPs? Also, if you can't follow orders and moderate whilst on RED, then just don't play on RED team. I mean no offense but you applied for staff, you should've known what you were getting into.

1.1 With the current system that is implemented on the servers, a red that attacks any guard for any reason, is a rebeller. Guard baiting? Hit them to go away? REBELLER. Lets say that all reds failed to do an order and the warden wanted to pardon them. According to the rules he can only pardon all of them, otherwise it would be favoritism, but he cant pardon the one guy because he has the rebeller status, which is dumb and contradicting.
But if they aren't rebelling by our rules then they don't fall under the ruling, it specifies Rebels for a reason not Prisoners or Reds. It would be too complicated to create a system that properly detects and gives out rebel status based on our rules, and it is not worth it when most players have an understanding that rebel status does not automatically equal a user is a rebel/KOS.

1.2 If staff are the only ones to define it, why not just make a simple way of understanding it, instead of having 25 (somewhat) different definitions of it? I get that staff should be smarter than most of the players, but it's still a massive point of confusion when i tell people that make their custom last requests involve a red,

I don't wanna hear the reasoning "its common knowledge". No its not. We're talking about the internet. There is no common knowledge and everyone needs a simple & clear way of understanding things cut in pieces and served on a plate.
It's better than have 25+ ways something can be favoritism, I mean it could maybe be condensed into certain rulings but I'd like to trust staff to interpret situations and logically deduce if something is favoring other red unfairly rather than creating a large list of what is and isn't favoritist.
 

Frussly

Patience, I dont have.
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#6
I've played hundreds of hours of JB, most of it on RED. This has rarely ever intefered with my ability to moderate effectively. It does not take long to type a command to slay a rouge blue.
So have i. 450 hours alone of my game time on wonderland servers, are Jailbreak-Only. And i still don't see a problem having the warden being able to slay whilst staff is on.
There is no way for you, still following orders & doing what the warden says, to be able to moderate as well as you could from spectator or blue/guards. It's a smaller problem/less time consuming factor to respawn someone who was innocent and make people aware why and how he got there, than having to ask every single person that was involved in set "accident" hear their story, make a decision based on those, because you didn't know what was going, because you were playing as red or was focusing on something else.

You've said it's dumb and contradicting but you've literally supplied no reasons as to why that's true.
You literally cannot cover every edgecase of what favouritism is or any rule for that matter.
I never meant to edgecase every single rule, since its gonna be complicated & unreadable in the end, but having a slight example on lets the Custom LR. The Red Always write whatever they want, and that they/another red can be the judge/trainer/wait it out and fight vs the last guy, like they are safe just because they won previous round. That is not how it works though? But they don't understand that and it still happens, because unless staff is on, No-one tells them that they cant, because they simply don't know either.

Regarding the No D&D, ill take an example from former staff & VIP member Ray and how he does his things.

Ray always kill people if they don't take the outmost fastest way possible when given the No D&D order. Which in hindsight is perfectly fine, because most wardens are more lenient on that order than others, and he is right to kill them if they do not.
Following that logic, if you tell them to go to the blue line in per say the v10d minecraft jailbreak map, if they don't go the closest to them, they are KOS, considering its a delay if going to any other? I really don't get how you do not see it, but it might just be me.
I wouldn't have to specify unless i want them to take the line further away (knifepit).

Its a delay, if they don't take the fastest route.
Do not detour, or delay = Take the fastest route
 
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#7
Do not delay the round or stall the round.
I agree. People can try to delay or detour and get a way with it but it should not be considered 'freekill' if Warden and their guards do not tolerate it. It's common sense to fullfill the task as soon as possible, for the new players, they'll learn it very quickly either by dying or by watching others. I still die for things I haven't encoutered before and though I ask an explanation in chat, it get's overlooked to which causing me to die. I learned the hard way the meaning of certain orders, new players will too.

But the phrase "no detour or delay" shouldn't even be mentioned, it's something automatically implied. Neither should be the phrase "no projectiles" to be honest. I mean, if you hit a guard with a melee or projectile, it should both be considered rebelling (with exception on baiting."

Wardens not being able to slay whilst staff is on.
What if a Guard is freehitting and killing people he baited while staff just went afk? I mean, sometimes you got to handle quickly the situation to prevent it going out of control. And if you gotta wait to get a reply or to realise that staff is afk, it can be a small mess. To say that Warden can abuse their voteslay while staff is on, isn't that the perfect moment to see if the Warden is a good or bad player? If he slays someone that deserved to be slayed, all is good right? And if he doesn't slay when needed or slays when not needed, they you know he is not fit to be on the blue team. I find this the perfect oppertunity to see how well people are dealing with being Warden. Especially if they would come to apply for admin to the forum because you'll know if they could deal with having power.

*stuff about rebelling status and pardoning and favoritism*
A warden can decide whether rebels can be pardonned or not. If Warden decides to pardon, he has to pardon the group and not individual players as that would be favouritism. Though if a group has dissobeyed orders while another has killed a guard, he should have the right to pardon all dissobeyers but not the killer. Basically pardon on action, not on player.

Favouritism should not be allowed and thus things where a red gets an advantage without earning it means favouritism. I seen people asking in their custom request for priviledge like "me 1v1 the winner of hunger games" or "me as pokémon trainer". You should only be allowed to request the game modes in these situations. I also have seen a Warden pick a player as trainer in the game instead of picking the winner by asking a question, which is I believe also favouritism.

This is all written in my opinion.
 

StarOfSouls

it's not fair
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#8
Completely agree with everything Frussly wrote. It should be fixed like he mentioned. Also, you really think the rules will be confusing? No, they really won't. Even if it did be confusing, it really is better to enforce existing rules than rules not stated. Warden should be able to slay while staff is on, it's only a death, you can wait until next round. It's not a big deal. Anyone should be able to be pardoned in any situation, the rebeller status shouldn't interfere with the warden's ability to pardon reds. I think that's everything.
 

R4

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#9
So have i. 450 hours alone of my game time on wonderland servers, are Jailbreak-Only. And i still don't see a problem having the warden being able to slay whilst staff is on.
There is no way for you, still following orders & doing what the warden says, to be able to moderate as well as you could from spectator or blue/guards. It's a smaller problem/less time consuming factor to respawn someone who was innocent and make people aware why and how he got there, than having to ask every single person that was involved in set "accident" hear their story, make a decision based on those, because you didn't know what was going, because you were playing as red or was focusing on something else.
Once again, I have never had this issue nor has Eight or any other staff I know.
Why is it harder when playing red to moderate? You've not actually given any reasons just stated it as a universal truth which it is not.

For a start how would you know someone is innocent, if as you said you aren't paying attention or are uncapable of understanding the situation on red team?
Secondly, warden slay is for last resort only. Wardens are not staff, the option is only added for emergencies when staff are unavailable and a blue breaking the rules is causing serious problems.
When staff are online they should be doing their job.

I never meant to edgecase every single rule, since its gonna be complicated & unreadable in the end, but having a slight example on lets the Custom LR. The Red Always write whatever they want, and that they/another red can be the judge/trainer/wait it out and fight vs the last guy, like they are safe just because they won previous round. That is not how it works though? But they don't understand that and it still happens, because unless staff is on, No-one tells them that they cant, because they simply don't know either.
I mean what sort of example?
Ultimately it just comes down of where to stop, one example, two, ten. It'll never be enough because people don't read the rules in the first place. I don't really see a reason to add specifically to custom LR.

Regarding the No D&D, ill take an example from former staff & VIP member Ray and how he does his things.

Ray always kill people if they don't take the outmost fastest way possible when given the No D&D order. Which in hindsight is perfectly fine, because most wardens are more lenient on that order than others, and he is right to kill them if they do not.
Following that logic, if you tell them to go to the blue line in per say the v10d minecraft jailbreak map, if they don't go the closest to them, they are KOS, considering its a delay if going to any other? I really don't get how you do not see it, but it might just be me.
I wouldn't have to specify unless i want them to take the line further away (knifepit).

Its a delay, if they don't take the fastest route.
Do not detour, or delay = Take the fastest route
Once again I repeat the primary role of the warden.
To give clear, specific orders. If a warden is not specific then it's open to interpetation, you cannot punish someone becuase you didn't specify which line and they had to guess. That's not how it works.
If the warden gives an open which is unclear and reasonably open to interpetation then reds are free to interpt it whatever way they wish.
The alternative, just enables lazy wardening and punishes players for not guessing what the warden wanted which is the anthesis of fair.
 

R4

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#10
I agree. People can try to delay or detour and get a way with it but it should not be considered 'freekill' if Warden and their guards do not tolerate it. It's common sense to fullfill the task as soon as possible, for the new players, they'll learn it very quickly either by dying or by watching others. I still die for things I haven't encoutered before and though I ask an explanation in chat, it get's overlooked to which causing me to die. I learned the hard way the meaning of certain orders, new players will too.

But the phrase "no detour or delay" shouldn't even be mentioned, it's something automatically implied. Neither should be the phrase "no projectiles" to be honest. I mean, if you hit a guard with a melee or projectile, it should both be considered rebelling (with exception on baiting."
It is considered rebelling, when you say "no projectiles" you are merely ordering them to not throw them at anything. For example a wall.

As for D&D being implied, It's a bad idea.
Specifying D&D as a seperate order makes it very clear to reds as wardens all have different standards of what delaying is.

What if a Guard is freehitting and killing people he baited while staff just went afk? I mean, sometimes you got to handle quickly the situation to prevent it going out of control. And if you gotta wait to get a reply or to realise that staff is afk, it can be a small mess. To say that Warden can abuse their voteslay while staff is on, isn't that the perfect moment to see if the Warden is a good or bad player? If he slays someone that deserved to be slayed, all is good right? And if he doesn't slay when needed or slays when not needed, they you know he is not fit to be on the blue team. I find this the perfect oppertunity to see how well people are dealing with being Warden. Especially if they would come to apply for admin to the forum because you'll know if they could deal with having power.
Staff should never AFK on servers, doing so prevents reports from going through among other things.
Players always try impress staff when they are online, how they act in front of known staff is a fairly useless indicator of their suitability for an admin role or even being on the blue team.
Warden slay as I mentioned earlier is for last resorts only, not something to be used unless there is a serious reason too and staff are unavailable.
 

R4

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#11
Completely agree with everything Frussly wrote. It should be fixed like he mentioned. Also, you really think the rules will be confusing? No, they really won't. Even if it did be confusing, it really is better to enforce existing rules than rules not stated. Warden should be able to slay while staff is on, it's only a death, you can wait until next round. It's not a big deal. Anyone should be able to be pardoned in any situation, the rebeller status shouldn't interfere with the warden's ability to pardon reds. I think that's everything.
Listing every single edge case would make the rules literally unreadable.
Certain rules will always be open ended, that's just the nature of it you cannot consider every single scenario that will occur and write a rule to deal with it. This is the very reason laws are often left open ended.

False slaying is a big deal, it's as simple as that. It shouldn't happen and we shouldn't let it happen.

Allowing favouritism by allowing pardoning of single reds is also something we clearly shouldn't allow.

Try making actual points and giving reasons for why things should be changed instead.
 
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#12
Try making actual points and giving reasons for why things should be changed instead.
I have no say in any of this since, I rarely play this mode but this could come off as a bit rude. Not telling you what to say but that's how I view it and others could view it.
 

Eight

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#13
Completely agree with everything Frussly wrote. It should be fixed like he mentioned. Also, you really think the rules will be confusing? No, they really won't. Even if it did be confusing, it really is better to enforce existing rules than rules not stated. Warden should be able to slay while staff is on, it's only a death, you can wait until next round. It's not a big deal. Anyone should be able to be pardoned in any situation, the rebeller status shouldn't interfere with the warden's ability to pardon reds. I think that's everything.
- The Favoritism rule is stated, just be logical and don't give an advantage to select reds over others. As R4 said, favoritism can manifest in many ways, it'd leave us open to loopholes and error if we even attempted to list every single way someone could be favortist.
- No it is a big deal, we can not trust warden to make moderation decisions of a server given he is not a staff member, if we allow him to warden vote slay it will only lead to needless issues. You could also make the same argument about it "only being a death" for freekilling, team killing, etc. We don't want to unlawfully ruin gameplay for others period.
- Warden can not just pardon willy nilly, his pardons must be reasonable. Allowing freedom of pardoning allows freedom of wardens to favor others.
 

R4

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#14
I have no say in any of this since, I rarely play this mode but this could come off as a bit rude. Not telling you what to say but that's how I view it and others could view it.
I have little tolerance for people who just post to try support their friends rather than critically anaylazing the situation and coming to a conclusion.
 
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#15
I have little tolerance for people who just post to try support their friends rather than critically anaylazing the situation and coming to a conclusion.
But...That's their views on the matter. You cant devalue someone else's views because you think their just supporting someone they probably don't even know or do know. Unless you're talking about me and I really couldn't careless what this matter is about.
 

StarOfSouls

it's not fair
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#16
Whenever a warden tells the inmates to go to the blue line without detours or delays, there is a good reason as to why at least 90% of those inmates choose to go to the one closest to their cells. Despite no detours or delays not directly meaning as fast as possible, 90% of those players chose to go to the first blue line because they all interpret no detours or delays to mean as quickly as possible. If your goals are to make the rules common knowledge, than I think changing the definition of no detours or delays to mean as quickly as possible would easily contribute to that goal as this is something that constantly happens. I think this whole problem of reds going on other blu lines would be fixed easily. It would cause those players to not go where they're going, and reinforce the thoughts that the inmates at the first blue line have about no detours or delays.
 

LUV

ɢᴏyᴀʀᴅ ɢᴏᴅ
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#17
Whenever a warden tells the inmates to go to the blue line without detours or delays, there is a good reason as to why at least 90% of those inmates choose to go to the one closest to their cells. Despite no detours or delays not directly meaning as fast as possible, 90% of those players chose to go to the first blue line because they all interpret no detours or delays to mean as quickly as possible. If your goals are to make the rules common knowledge, than I think changing the definition of no detours or delays to mean as quickly as possible would easily contribute to that goal as this is something that constantly happens. I think this whole problem of reds going on other blu lines would be fixed easily. It would cause those players to not go where they're going, and reinforce the thoughts that the inmates at the first blue line have about no detours or delays.
It's not specified which blue line, so the inmate(s) can freely choose and go to any blue line. However, I do see the same point you're trying to make alongside Frussly.
 
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#18
Try making actual points and giving reasons for why things should be changed instead.
It isn't because you dissagree with certain arguements that those arguements aren't valid. There are people whom are agreeing with given reasons so maybe you can open up to the fact not everyone has the same thought about certain rules and thus you should allow people to discuss about it instead of shutting them down in such a rude way claiming "it's not an actual point or reason". I told you before that your view doesn't mean is wrong but at the same time it doesn't mean others their view are wrong either. It can be interpreted differently, hence why this thread was made.

Admins should not be forced either to be active when on a server. If something comes inbetween for them to go afk for a certain time, regardless it being a minute to take a leak or half an hour because getting called away from the PC thinking it'll be less than a minute but you get ordered to go the store now or something (I'm assuming not all admins live at their own place yet). And as said before, it's perfect to notice who is doing a good job with given power (as Warden or donator) and who should not be allowed to have any power. Because it's harder to get evidence on a situation if it has passed and the context is missing in pictures.
 
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#19
This whole thread goes show how insanely difficult jailbreak is lmao
 

StarOfSouls

it's not fair
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#20
This whole thread goes show how insanely difficult jailbreak is lmao
It's not difficult, it's just an argument about how rules are interpreted, which cannot be removed, and interpretation will always stay, but can be improved in some ways.
 
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